Chapter 65: Desperation Lead to Death-The Murder of Kenneth Nix

WEBVTT

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Hi guys. I'm Courtney and I'm
Lisa, and welcome to the next chapter

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in the Book of the Dead.
Brought to you by Dark Cast Network indie

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Podcasts with a Twist. Hello,
Hello, Welcome to the next chapter.

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Lisa's back. She feels better,
Yes I do. It's just allergies.

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Anyone that suffers with allergies. No, oh, it's terrible. So before

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we begin, I just wanted to
let you guys know that we are having

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biased, maybe not, but I like

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our merch. I think it's cool. Anyway, we're gonna jump right in.

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The story I have for you today
is an interesting one one that really

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shows what a person can do when
they're backed into a corner, or when

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they feel like they are backed into
a corner. So this is the murder

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of Kenneth Nicks. Kenneth Nicks,
who went by Ken, was born in

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Lake Charles, Louisiana. He was
the oldest of six children, and he

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loved cars and motorcycles. Well.
His son Kevin said, quote, my

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dad was a very good mechanic.
He was the youngest Texico gas station owner

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in Lake Charles. According to all
sources, Ken was while a very good

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businessman, he was not very successful
when it came to love. He met

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and married his first wife in nineteen
sixty six and they had three children together.

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During that time, they moved to
Tulsa, Oklahoma, but ultimately Ken

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and his wife got a divorce,
and over the next ten years, Ken

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would marry three more times. While
his relationships continued to struggle. Ken started

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a diving business in nineteen eighty called
Inland divers Ink, which offered scupa diving

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and underwater salvage, and it was
going fabulously. He was a really,

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really great businessman. Four years after
starting Inland divers, Ken meets Judith Bailey.

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Judith was also divorced. She had
been married in the late nineteen sixties,

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but following the birth of her daughters, Angela and Michelle, Judith and

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her husband divorced. She was originally
from Texas, but had moved to Tulsa

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and she worked as an accountant.
After meeting, Judith and Kenneth hit it

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off, and in nineteen eighty five
they married in Las Vegas and moved into

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a house in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. Soon after, Judith started working as

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the bookkeeper for inland divers. Now
they were married for thirty years, and

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for a while things were seemingly great, and they lived and worked happily together,

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but by the two thousands, things
started falling apart. According to Oxygen,

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Kevin said, quote, my father
raised me and my brother to be

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on our own and not be dependent
on anybody, But Judy coddled her kids,

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financed her kids anytime they had a
problem, and that caused turmoil between

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my father and Judy. Communication between
the two was diminishing. Now I will

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say there's absolutely nothing wrong with the
way that both of them decided to raise

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their children. There's nothing wrong with
Judy coddling her daughters or financially supporting them,

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and there's nothing wrong with Ken teaching
his kids to be independent. But

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I think the main issue was they
both had these wildly different parenting styles,

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and that's where part of the problem
was. I can see from Ken's point

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of view, why Judy supporting her
daughters was a problem for him because her

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daughters were adults by this point,
and I'm sure he thought they needed to

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do things on their own without their
mother's help. But I can also see

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why Judy disagreed with Ken's parenting style
as well. I'm sure she was thinking

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along the lines of if a child
needs help, regardless of age, then

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the parents should supply that help if
they have the means to. I can

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see both sides, and I can
also see why this was putting a wedge

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between them, you know what I
mean? Absolutely, as you said,

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it's two almost polar opposites in how
they're going to raise their children. According

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to medium dot com, in January
of twenty eleven, Ken files for citing

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irreconcilable differences, but he allegedly rescinded
two weeks later. A few months later,

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in August, Judy files for divorce
for the same reason, but she

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also filed for an order of protection
against Ken, saying that she was fearful

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of her life and that Ken was
violent and had been abusing her for the

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last two years. However, this
order of protection case was allegedly dismiss is

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when both Ken and Judith failed to
show up for the hearing. The divorce

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itself was finalized in September of twenty
eleven, but in the short period between

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the filing and the divorce being granted, the police allegedly responded to three different

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calls to the home and Broken Arrow. However, the calls came from both

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Judith and Ken, so Judith said
that Ken was violent, but Ken was

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also allegedly saying that she was violent
with him as well. After the divorce,

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Judith moved out, but it seems
as if they had reconciled to some

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extent because according to all reports,
Judith started spending a lot of time with

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Ken in Broken Arrow. Now.
I don't know if they were considering back

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together. That's allegedly what her lawyer
was saying that he had heard that they

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had gotten back together, but at
the very least they were very friendly and

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Judith even still had a key to
her former home. It seems as if

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their relationship was healing, and over
the next couple of years there's no reports

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of anything going on that raised any
red flax. That is until March twenty

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first, twenty sixteen. At around
nine pm. On March twenty first,

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Broken Arrow police get a desperate call
for help from Judith. Next. During

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this call, Judith said she had
stopped by Ken's home to drop off dinner

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for him, and she had found
him debt of an apparent gunshot wound.

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He was sixty nine years old.
Judith told the dispatcher, according to News

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on six, quote it looks like
someone shot him. There's a gun lying

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right by his left hand. And
when asked by dispatch if Kenneth had been

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displaying thoughts of suicide, she said, quote, yes, he's very despondent.

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He's got so many health issues.
Neuropathy is getting so painful. He

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just can't deal with it anymore.
He is so active, he can't hardly

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deal with this. And according to
Disabilitymemorial dot Or, Kenneth was suffering from

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chronic nerve disease or peripheral neuropathy.
As a little background, According to the

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National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke, peripheral neuropathy quote refers to the many

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conditions that involve damage to the peripheral
nervous system, which is a vast communications

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network that sends signals between the central
nervous system and all other parts of the

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body. So these signals control everything
we do, from moving, feeling,

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temperature, the function of our organs. Everything your body does, your nervous

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system is telling it what to do. There are three types of nerves.

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Motor, which controls the movement of
all muscles under conscious control, Sensory,

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which are the nerves that transmit information
like the feeling of touch, temperature,

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or pain, and autonomic, which
controls your organs to regulate the things you

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do without conscious thought, like breathing
or heart function. So symptoms vary depending

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on the severity, but they usually
aren't life threatening and can include painful cramps,

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uncontrollable twitching and muscle shrinking, heat
intolerance, loss of feeling and reflexes,

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gastro intestinal symptoms, problems swallowing.
I mean, the list goes on.

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It really depends on what is being
affected and the severity of neuropathy.

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But the main point of this is
that his neuropathy could have been severe enough

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that it drove him to suicide.
Based on what Judith was saying, Okay,

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well, if you're in constant pain, no, it is not condoning

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anything, but constant pain can honestly
make you so frustrated, So you know

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when you're in constant pain. It's
kind of you know, you're in you

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know, desperate people do desperate things
just to have some relief. Yeah,

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so's it's very possible, you know, based on what Judith is saying,

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that the pain he was in was
so bad and he was so active or

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had been so active that you know, it drove him to suicide. At

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least that's what Judith is saying happened. Right. This is not a this

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is a definite, this is exactly
what happened kind of scenario. But you

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do understand the as you said,
the desperation in not feeling well. The

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officers arrive and Judith leads them to
the master bedroom, where they find Kenneth

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in bed, a gunshot wound to
his left temple and a pistol right next

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to him. According to oxygen dot
Com, when Judith was asked when she

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had last seen ken she said,
quote, the last time I was here

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was the night before between four to
five pm, and I left because he

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got kind of grumpy and tired.
She then told police that she had called

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before coming by with dinner, but
he never answered her call. Pretty much

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as soon as the investigation begins,
though, police were skeptical that Ken's cause

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of death was really suicide. For
one, the blood around the entrance wound

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was dry and there was lividity present. Now, the lividity being present was

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probably one of the bigger clues because
lividity or liver mortis, according to explore

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Forensics dot co dot uk is quote, the process through which the body's bloods

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apply will stop moving after the heart
has stopped pumping it around the inside of

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the deceased. What normally happens at
this point is that the blood supply will

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settle in direct response to gravity.
This displays itself as dark purple discoloration on

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the bodies, So a body lying
face down for an extended period of time

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will show this discoloration on the front
of the body, and someone lying on

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their back would have evidence of lividity
on the back of the body. Lividity,

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according to this begins within thirty minutes
of the heart stopping and can last

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up to twelve hours. Lividity can
only be disrupted during the first six hours

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that the body is moved. The
presence of lividity in Ken's case indicated to

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police that Ken had been dead for
hours. This doesn't rule out suicide,

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but this made the police suspicious.
The other indication that this was not suicide

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came when Ken's body was moved.
There was the original gunshot wound that police

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observed upon arrival, but they also
saw about one inch over a second bullet

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wound. You can't shoot yourself in
the head twice, I would not think.

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So. Please don't tell me that
they call this suicide because they the

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police have done or in other cases
that we've covered, they've done just that

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where someone has been murdered, where
they're stabbed or they're shot, and the

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police ruled a suicide, and I
think everybody was shaking their head, going

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like, how does that happen?
Gee? Let me think about one we

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covered not too long ago where they
said this young man killed himself, except

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his hands were in his pockets and
there was no shellcasing. We're still mad

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about Alex Bendelson because it doesn't make
sense. It's impossible, I have or

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it. Look. I asked my
expert, who was in the military for

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twenty five years, knows pretty much
every single weapon inside and out, can

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take them apart and put them together
in under a minute, depending on the

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weapon it is, He said,
as I was asking the question, which

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I already knew the answer to,
but I just wanted confirmation, said that

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is impossible. Yes, we're a
little salty, so you can't. It's

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impossible. If someone can explain this
to me, please do so. But

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you cannot shoot yourself twice, No
you can't. So police are suspicious.

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Good. But the other thing that
really solidified their suspicion was there were bloodstains

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on his shirt that didn't match up
with the injuries, nor did they match

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up to the position he was found
in, indicating that he had been moved.

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And finally, the medical examiner determined
that Friend's time of death was seven

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thirty am, the day before he
was found, almost fourteen hours before Judith

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claimed to have found him, so
police knew this was a homicide, besides

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the fact that according to Judith,
she had seen Ken at around four or

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five pm the day before, but
he was already dead according to the medical

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examiner. So I'm calling Shananigan's on
her story and the police are calling Shananigan's

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on her story exactly. So it's
not really clear how police got to Michelle,

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Judith's daughter, not sure how or
what led them to her. But

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they go speak to her and they
ask her about the relationship between her mom

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and Ken, and Michelle says that
the relationship was not good. Ken was

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abusive and she and her sister Angela
didn't get along with him either. Now,

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when asked where she was the day
that Ken and died, according to

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Oxygen, Michelle says she had gone
to Kent's house at around eleven am and

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met her mother there, who gave
her some money, but she never entered

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the house. Now, this is
also what Judith told police, but they

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weren't buying the story, so Michelle
is actually arrested under suspicion of being an

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accessory to murder. According to Coco
News five, after Michelle's arrest, police

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get a call from a man named
Todd Moore, who was the estranged husband

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of Angela, Michelle's sister, and
he had a very interesting story to share

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with the police. According to prosecutor
Benjamin fu Todd said that Michelle and Angela

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had come to Todd and told him
that Judith had shot Ken and tried to

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get him to help them cover up
the crime, which he refused. So

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the police talked to Judith again,
who, according to News to Oklahoma,

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may have been in the hospital at
this point. I'm assuming, given that

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she was also sixty nine in that
paramedic sticker the hospital to treat her for

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possible shock after she had called nine
one she had a medical condition or something

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and she went to the hospital.
So they go to the hospital and speak

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to her. And this whole investigation, as a side note, happened very

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quickly because she was at the hospital
almost immediately after police questioned her after she

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found Ken's body and speaking to Michelle. This whole investigation took like a day,

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Like Ken was found on a Sunday, and by Monday all arrests had

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been made Like this was like twenty
four hours or less. I think you

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part of the reason is that the
story didn't line up with I mean,

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I can't imagine the autopsy just being
that quick. Normally it takes more time,

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no, of course, And I
mean the the medical examiner could have

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tested or determined time of death at
the scene. I mean that has to

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do. There are different variables that
help determine time of death. You have

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the libidity, you have rigor mortis, you have body temperature. I mean,

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there are plenty of things to help
determine that. So he could have

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done that at the scene. No, absolutely, and I wasn't saying that,

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but normally a full autopsy takes more
than twenty four hours. However,

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they knew approximate time of death,
which did not line up with the story

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that his strange wife ex wife was
telling. So the clues were there,

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you know, it was just kind
of connecting the dots exactly, the police

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exactly. So this was, again, as a side note, a very

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quick investigation. So they go to
the hospital and they ask her what happened,

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and they inform her, Look,
we have arrested Michelle because we think

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that she may not have killed Ken, but we think that she helped someone

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do it. So Judith, we
already know, would do pretty much anything

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for her daughters, given that she
supports them financially, and it's already been

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established she'd do anything for them.
So she hears that Michelle has been arrested

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and she starts talking. So she
tells police that Ken was very lonely due

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to his medical issues, but impossible
to live with, and then Ken said

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that she owed him money that he
had allegedly given to her daughters. She

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said, quote, he's threatened me
all the time. He's hit me verbally,

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abusive, absolutely just out of this
world. You know, it's easy

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to say you can just leave,
but I love the guy. She tells

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police that on the day of the
murder, Ken had told her that she

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owed him over twenty thousand dollars and
when she said she didn't have it,

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he pulled the gun on her and
said he would kill her if she didn't

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pay. Judith said that they had
struggled with the gun and it went off

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twice. Then she called her daughters
and asked him to help her because she

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panicked, which is a very good
story. And I am not one to

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diminish domestic violence or anything like that. I am not saying that Ken was

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or was not a violent person.
I don't know that. However, according

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to Judith herself, Ken had severe
neuropathy that implies that the man could not

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move very well. Again, I
don't know his full medical history. I

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have no idea how severe his symptoms
was, but the implication is that a

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very active man was very despondent.
Because his neuropathy was so severe, that

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implies again that he could not move
very well. He most likely had numbness

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to his extremities and a lot of
pain. You can't move very well under

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those conditions. One two there was
zero's sign of a struggle in the bedroom,

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none whatsoever. So the implication then
is, how does a man with

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severe neuropathy, clearly lying in bed
struggle with an able bodied woman with no

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sign of a struggle? Like,
how does that happen? Your guess is

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as good as mine. It does
it make sense to me? And obviously

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it does not make sense to you. But what did she have to say

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about this? So like this,
this is where I'm going. I want

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to hear the story. Well,
police don't think it's a very convincing story

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either, because they arrest her at
the hospital and charge her with first degree

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murder, and they actually track down
Angela and arrest her as an accessory as

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well, according to ktul Now.
According to Tulsa World, when questioned again,

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Michelle told police that she and Angela
had discussed the murder with their mother,

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and she had contemplated staging a robbery, a suicide, or just running

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away. And when he heard about
you disarrest her, divorced lawyer Gregory Meyer

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was shocked. He said, quote
from what I recall about the relationship.

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I would have thought it was the
other way around. The Judith I knew

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was not a murderer. So at
least according to Meyer, he's saying,

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if someone was going to be murdered, out of the two of them,

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it would have been Judith. But
he's also her lawyer, not Ken's lawyer,

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right, so you really know him
exactly. He's hearing things from Judith

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about their relationship, he's not hearing
them from Ken. But again, I'm

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not saying he was or was not
a violent man. For all I know

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he was. He could have been, but I don't know that he could

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have been a great guy. You
know, according to his son, he

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was a great guy. But Judith
is not as innocent as she seems.

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Police continue investigating after the arrests and
discovered text messages that Judith had exchanged with

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her daughters. According to Oxygen,
she spoke about how much she hated Ken

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in these text messages, and days
before the murder, she had also discussed

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a gun that was similar in description
to the gun found at the scene with

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her daughter. Kevin also told police
that Judith would steal money and prescription drugs

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from his father and when he would
confront her about it, she would tell

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Ken he was crazy. Police also
discovered that Judith was in an insane amount

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of debt and believed that this was
the motive for the murder. They believed

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that Ken found out about the debt
and possibly said she had to pay him

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back or he was done with her
and she lost it. According to their

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divorce agreement, if Ken died,
Judith would get the house in broken Arrow,

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So they believed he was killed so
that she could sell the house and

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settle some of her debt after she
acquired the apse, which is very possible.

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Again, it's very possible she fell
backed into a corner, you know.

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If Ken found out about the debt
that she was in and confronted her

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about it, it's very possible that
she freaked out. Well, how many

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times do you hear that someone is
murdered because you know, money, It's

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exactly, It's a very common motive
that people have for murder. It is

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out of desperation, as they said, desperate. I am I am not

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condoning murder in any way, shape
or form, but they say desperate times

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call for desperate measures, And you
don't know how desperate she was you have

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to be desperate. How could you
possibly, you know, murder somebody.

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So is it possible that her she
fell backed into a corner? Yes?

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Is it? Is it an excuse? No, there's never an excuse for

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this. But you hear it all
the time. You know, someone's murdered

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for their life insurance, someone's murdered
for an inheritance, or they weren't going

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to share the inheritance. So people
do these crazy, crazy evil things when

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they think that they are or they
feel that they are backed into a corner.

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Now, according to Tulsa World,
when they go to trial, Judith's

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defense tries very hard to argue that
Judith was suffering from battered wife syndrome,

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which led to Ken's murder. They
described him as quote a serial physical and

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emotional abuser who isolated Judith from her
family and initiated an altercation that resulted in

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his death. Now, I will
say there is no evidence of that anywhere.

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No one in any of the sources
I read said anything about that level

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of abuse. Again, no one
knows the relationship that intimately except for the

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two of them, and Judith is
the only one around to tell the story.

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But there's no evidence of that.
You know, as far as I

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know, there were no domestic violence
called prior to the divorce being filed,

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you know. So maybe they didn't
have a great relationship where they yelled and

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screamed at each other a lot.
But from what I'm gathering, it doesn't

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seem like Ken was abusive and their
relationship was that toxic to that level where

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there was isolation and physical abuse and
things like that. But again, there

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could have been, but it seems
like if there was, it was on

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both parts at least according to what
Kevin said. What I don't understand is,

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you know, she raised her children, you know, and she always

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helped them and whatnot. Where did
she get the money to i'll say,

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support them in their times of need? If he wasn't aware of it.

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For all, I mean, she
was the bookkeeper for his company, for

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all I know, she was using
the money from the company. That's where

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00:25:00.400 --> 00:25:03.839
the twenty thousand dollars she owed him
came from. If if she really owed

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him twenty thousand dollars. Again,
that's what Judah is saying, right well,

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this is this is the question that
I have. You know, how

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do you I guess she could have
embezzled the money. But if she's if

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she's saying that he kept her from
her family, well he didn't keep her

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from her daughters. Yeah, I
mean, I don't know what of the

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family there was. And again she
was originally from Texas and they had moved

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to Oklahoma, so I mean she
wasn't seeing her family that often physically.

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I mean, it could have been
in the case of Lynett cost you know,

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where he wouldn't allow her to talk
on the phone but with to her

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family. But I don't know if
that was the case. But either way,

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I mean, she was getting the
money to support her daughters from somewhere,

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and the logical assumption was that she
was getting it straight from Ken.

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So if their relationship was that volatile, I don't see him giving her that

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money. If he really was this
terrible Person's that's what I'm getting at it.

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I'm agreeing with you one hundred percent. They don't the pieces don't fit

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together. No, I agree.
I agree. That's you know, there's

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a disconnect there someplace. Now again, you don't have you weren't there,

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We weren't there, Nobody else was
there. You know, you weren't a

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fly on the wall watching their lives
go by. But you can't say that

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he's, you know, keeping her
from her family when obviously her daughters are

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in her life and she's helping to
support them in their times of need.

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She's she got the money somehow somewhere, you know. I mean, she's

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just saving her quote unquote salary so
that in case her children need that,

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she's got it for them exactly.
It's the story doesn't quite make sense,

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especially when you're looking at it that
way now. In response to this defense

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strategy, the Battered Wipe Syndrome prosecutor
Benjamin Fuch said that this claim made a

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mockery of battered women and although the
jury may not like Ken, based on

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what was being said by the defense, quote, evidence showed that his ex

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wife meant for him to die when
she shot him. To end arguments about

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00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:22.960
finances, he said, quote,
how is he an aggressor as he's sitting

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with a gunshot wound to the face, literally never leaving the perimeter of his

335
00:27:27.160 --> 00:27:33.880
bed. Angela and Michelle also testified
against their mother about her disgusting killing Ken

336
00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:37.359
with them and were adamant that Ken
was abusive and that Judith was defending herself

337
00:27:37.400 --> 00:27:42.640
against him, but they were also
never charged with being an accessory, most

338
00:27:42.720 --> 00:27:48.279
likely as a result of testifying.
So it was probably like to save face

339
00:27:48.359 --> 00:27:51.759
with their mother, you know what
I mean, Like, we're not getting

340
00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:56.160
charged for this, you are,
but like because we're testifying you, but

341
00:27:56.359 --> 00:28:00.160
we're gonna we're gonna say things in
your defense try and get you off too,

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00:28:00.519 --> 00:28:03.559
you know what I mean? Oh
I do? I do? I

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mean that's their mom, that's the
person that again helped them out when they

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00:28:10.440 --> 00:28:17.480
needed help. And if she's not
around because she goes to prison, well

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00:28:17.799 --> 00:28:22.720
that financial help is no longer there. So the defense failed to prove there

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00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:26.799
was any evidence of a struggle,
and the prosecution did their best to prove

347
00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:30.279
that the scene was stage, showing
messages that Judith had sent her daughters that

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I mentioned before, and showing that
by placing the gun next to Ken in

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bed and then leaving to buy fried
chicken and sending a message about bringing Ken

350
00:28:37.880 --> 00:28:41.599
dinner, she was further setting up
the scene to look like a suicide.

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The defense brings in a mental health
expert, Kyle Groman, who testified that

352
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he believed Judith had battered woman's syndrome
Major depressive disorder and another personality disorder with

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mixed the Boyden independent traits. But
upon cross examination, Groman admitted that battered

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Woman's syndrome is not listed in the
manual of Mental disorders used by the medical

355
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community, and that it's a subset
of PTSD. Ultimately, after two hours

356
00:29:08.160 --> 00:29:12.720
of deliberation, in March of twenty
seventeen, Judith is found guilty of first

357
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degree murder and sentenced to life in
prison with the possibility of parole after thirty

358
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eight years. That would make her
one hundred and eight by the time she

359
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is up for parole. At sentencing, prosecutor Benjamin fu said, quote,

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what's unusual about this case and that
people don't expect is that the victim in

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this case was a male. He
was larger than his wife. He was

362
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a robust man. But victims of
domestic violence come in all shapes and sizes,

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They come from all walks of life. And the point we hope every

364
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family takes from this is that no
matter where you come from, when you

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come in our door, all victims
of crime are deserving of the same justice

366
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the system can offer, which I
think was a very powerful statement because it's

367
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true if this was a domestic violence
situation, which technically it would fall under

368
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that category regardless of whether there was
domestic violence in their relationship prior to the

369
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murder. She killed her pseudo ex
husband and I say pseudo x husband because

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it seemed like they were getting back
together. According to what Meyer said that

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he believed as far as he knew, that they did get back together.

372
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You know, she Judith murdered her
pseudo ex husband because of money, and

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this case just reinforces that the idea
that a man can experience domestic violence as

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well. So this was a different
case. You know, we don't see

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a lot of cases with the domestic
violence victim being a man. But it's

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important to show that men can suffer
domestic violence just as much as women.

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It just is not something that has
talked about as much because you know,

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00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:57.559
men are supposed to be big,
strong and right and found different, although

379
00:30:57.759 --> 00:31:03.880
the women are a quote unquot with
the weaker sex. So if there is

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00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:10.039
going to be domestic violent, it
tend you tend to think that it's the

381
00:31:10.079 --> 00:31:12.799
man against the woman, not the
other way around. And men don't.

382
00:31:14.240 --> 00:31:18.160
I don't think a lot of men
want to admit that they are the victims

383
00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:22.240
exactly. And there's no shame in
that. No, no, no,

384
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:26.000
no, I'm not saying that.
No, I'm saying that there's no shame

385
00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:30.440
in it. Like you, It's
like with depression. You know, men

386
00:31:30.519 --> 00:31:34.960
think that or people think that men
can't be depressed or show emotion, and

387
00:31:36.000 --> 00:31:40.720
that's just stupid. So that's the
murder of Kenneth Nicks. Down below.

388
00:31:40.759 --> 00:31:44.759
I'll have resources for domestic violence hotlines
like I try and put in for every

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00:31:44.759 --> 00:31:48.799
domestic violence case that we present.
And this was a sad one. Seems

390
00:31:48.839 --> 00:31:55.319
like he was a good man,
especially based on what Kevin, his son,

391
00:31:55.400 --> 00:31:59.079
said about him. You know,
at the very least, you know,

392
00:31:59.240 --> 00:32:02.319
he he loved his children very much. And to add an extra layer

393
00:32:02.440 --> 00:32:07.079
of sadness to this, the day
that he died was the day he became

394
00:32:07.119 --> 00:32:09.839
a great grandfather or his grandchild.
I don't know if it was granddaughter or

395
00:32:10.400 --> 00:32:16.079
his grandson had a baby. Great
granddaughter was born the day he was killed.

396
00:32:17.519 --> 00:32:22.920
The child will never know. Yeah, And Kevin said that he had

397
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:23.960
tried to call his dad, you
know, to tell him, like,

398
00:32:24.000 --> 00:32:28.160
you know, she was born,
she's here, and he never answered.

399
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:32.480
Obviously, he didn't answer and it
was just it adds an extra layer of

400
00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:39.880
sadness to the story because he you
know, he was only sixty nine.

401
00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:45.839
That is very young, right,
and he had many years He would have

402
00:32:45.839 --> 00:32:49.359
had many years with his great granddaughter. Right, It's an extra layer of

403
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:55.799
sad But I'm sure that Kevin tells
his granddaughter all sorts of stories about her

404
00:32:55.839 --> 00:33:01.519
great grandpa and he live on that
way. Yes, he's not truly gone

405
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:07.640
because he lives in their memories.
Yeah, and yeah, we hope,

406
00:33:07.759 --> 00:33:13.599
we hope you guys had a great
Thanksgiving. And again, check out the

407
00:33:13.640 --> 00:33:20.839
March Store for Black Friday sale and
check out our Patreon And next week we

408
00:33:20.920 --> 00:33:24.079
have an interview coming our way that
was a really good one and I hope

409
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you guys like it. So with
that, we will see you in the

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00:33:28.359 --> 00:33:32.319
next one. Have a lovely rest
a few week, and happy shopping for

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those that are shopping because of you
know, all of the upcoming holidays.

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Bye, guys, thank you so
much for listening to this chapter of the

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00:33:42.920 --> 00:33:46.440
Book of the Dead, and don't
forget that you can always connect with us

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00:33:46.559 --> 00:33:52.559
on Instagram, you can connect with
us on Twitter, and you can absolutely

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00:33:52.599 --> 00:33:57.839
connect with us on Patreon. We
also have a merch store as well that

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00:33:57.880 --> 00:34:02.319
we have frequent discount codes coming out
so that you guys can get merch hand

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00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:07.359
you're on by myself at a better
cost. We hope you have a lovely

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rest of your week and just remember
please be kind and don't forget to always

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stay safe, stay curious, and
stay vigilant. Bye guys, Byee.